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This looks as if it would work with how we like to do nearly everything - sit at the table, read outloud, talk about it, look for youtube videos that explain or demonstrate.

So, again, thanks. I think it is mostly comparing apples to apples but within each level reg chem, honours chem, and AP Chem there's going to be a continuum of difficulty - does that make sense? Because there doesn't seem to be any specific rules for what a reg chem or honours chem course covers just kind of a general guideline , there can be both "easy" and "difficult" reg chem and honours chem. AP is more standardized because it's assumed that all the AP students will be writing the standardized AP exam.

I think, of the honours chem courses I listed, that the Thinkwell course and using Chang General Chemistry would be at the "difficult" end of the continuum. All the other honours courses use texts or materials written for high school honours chem. The Chang book is actually a college book for non-STEM majors and the Thinkwell course is basically an AP course which should be at the level of first year college chem for STEM majors, if done correctly but doesn't worry about "teaching to the test".

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I think if honours chem is done with any good college text for non-STEM majors, then it will be honours but at the "difficult" end of the continuum. Algebra 2 is listed as a prereq for the difficult honours courses more to indicate problem-solving ability than actually math topics needed. Honours chem, as a general rule, would require knowledge of complicated algebraic manipulation working with multivariable formulae and being able to solve for any of the variables if the others are given , basic knowledge of angles for looking at bond angles but really no calculations involved , basic logs for calculating pH , dimensional analysis, knowledge of the quadratic equation and how to solve and interpret results, and the ability to work with and understand graphs.

The Chang text also requires students to work with the Arrhenius Equation - to get a more useful form, students take the natural log of both sides. Chang doesn't expect the students to derive this themselves - he just gives it to them - but they are expected to then work with it. Chang also requires students to work with the Henderson-Hasselbalch equation when dealing with buffer solutions - it involves logs as well.

I don't know if the honours courses written for high school would take the mathematical treatment of chemistry that far or not but I suspect not. That's why most of the honours courses only require Alg 1 but Thinkwell or any honours course taught with a good college non-major text may require Alg 2 - not for all the topics it covers maybe a few but for practice with solving more difficult problems that require more thinking. Chemistry is difficult enough to understand since it's very abstract the atomic or molecular level isn't exactly something that students have experience with in everyday life : without the student having to struggle with the math at the same time.

I think I love you. Like Parrothead, you've given me a lot to think on. I think dd can handle an honors course, but I'm not sure she could do the Alg 2 involved with Chang. Yes, that does help. Your description of Chang's treatment of the Arrhenius Equation sounds similar to the text we used last year. You can work the equations without a full understanding of the math involved. A quick comment on the Thinkwell courses, though: The level of the material in the "regular" and "AP" courses is exactly the same. I'm not sure of the answer to your question. There is a lot of Algebra used in the program, and it is structured so that a student can learn on his own when the teacher me has no clue about Chemistry.

The few questions he has had, I have been able to use the teacher's manual to answer. There are chapters on those subjects and they have calculations in the chapter, but if they are what you asked, I'm not sure. The lab kit comes with everything needed, except distilled water, a pan, and a stove. Ds16 hasn't reached that part yet, but flipping forward, he thinks so. Ds did Apologia Chemistry first semester this year.

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I would definitely say it is Chem light, not honors at all. We enjoyed it and he did well.

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It was just right for my non-mathy, non-science guy, but I have to strongly disagree with categorizing it as honors level. Would you all comment on Spectrum Chemistry? I would like to know where it falls in the spectrum of lite to rigorous, and how it compares to other texts on par with it As a parent with limited science background, I'm looking for a chemistry that I can implement and students can follow.

We will probably either use Spectrum at home or Apologia taught at a local home school covering. The other text I might consider is Conceptual Chemistry, but I would like some math included. CC has little to no math. My student will be taking Algebra II at the same time. Spectrum is great for kids who learn by doing.

It is lab heavy, although their kit seems easy to implement, and book light. I haven't used it, but it appears light on math from a distance. A couple of years ago I bought the Thames and Kosmos Chem. I like labs that are well-written and that eventually explain the result you should have had and why.

Where have people purchased their high school chemistry equipment from?

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Could you please share links, price, and a quick review? Thanks for the info, Debbie! I have to admit - it was tough trying to judge program levels when usually I could only see the table of contents and maybe the first few pages of the first lesson or chapter which quite often doesn't give an accurate representation of the difficulty level of the rest of the course. Like I say - I was waffling on Apologia and couldn't quite decide, based on the sample, where it belonged.

That's why I think that the more people that can contribute to this thread, the better! My lists are just starting points - hearing from folks who have used the programs is an invaluable source of wisdom. I'll change the Apologia entry and move it to the Reg Chem list. I really couldn't get a good feel from the Spectrum sample either but I was leaning towards Reg Chem although I think it's called honours chem on its website. If I were to list it under Reg Chem, is there anyone who has used it that could chime in and either agree or disagree? Thanks, Mary - that does help.

Thanks, Jackie. I'd hate for someone who wasn't really that into chemistry to order the Thinkwell "regular chem" and think they were just getting a basic, git-r-done kind of course. I think there would be some panic and shock involved I have never liked the mass-produced lab kits - but then I'm a super chem nerd so you may not want out of a lab kit what I want out of a lab kit. It didn't come with any cuvettes, though, so now I have get a hold of some of those If anyone else has access to a spectrophotometer, I have an awesome lab that I can give out - these are the lab objectives:.

To use the standard curve generated to determine the thiocyanate concentration in human saliva. Ya know I did list links for any lab kits that are available for any of the curricula above. I have ordered a few things through Amazon, believe it or not. I wanted a double burette clamp of a particular kind and found a supplier on Amazon. If you're planning on doing the Chang General Chem with your ds next year and you want to do the labs from the Tang resource, I can go through the labs and come up with a list of equipment and chemicals you would need.

Then you could just purchase the list through Home Science Tools or another supplier. I haven't really looked at the Tang labs yet but if any of them look prohibitive to do at home, I can probably give you alternate labs that are more home-friendly. I'm currently not at home but give me a few hours this evening and I can get that done. If you'd like.

Just wanted to say a quick thanks to the folks who have posted links or programs that I missed or who have jumped in to clarify things or add points of view. Keep it comin'! Combined wisdom rocks! Another textbook choice for regular chemistry is World of Chemistry by Zumdahl. We switched to this one midstream after a difficult time with the Prentice Hall Chemistry by Wilbraham et al same one Kolbe uses.

The explanations were SO much clearer in the Zumdahl book.