CHAIR-TALKS ON PERFECTION

The term "Christian Perfection" is grossly misunderstood by most Christians, including a significant number of those in the Holiness Chair-Talks On Perfection.
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Some scholars advance the view that Forms are paradigms, perfect examples on which the imperfect world is modeled. Others interpret Forms as universals, so that the Form of Beauty, for example, is that quality that all beautiful things share. Yet others interpret Forms as "stuffs," the conglomeration of all instances of a quality in the visible world.

Under this interpretation, we could say there is a little beauty in one person, a little beauty in another—all the beauty in the world put together is the Form of Beauty. Plato himself was aware of the ambiguities and inconsistencies in his Theory of Forms, as is evident from the incisive criticism he makes of his own theory in the Parmenides. Plato's main evidence for the existence of Forms is intuitive only and is as follows. We call both the sky and blue jeans by the same color, blue. However, clearly a pair of jeans and the sky are not the same color; moreover, the wavelengths of light reflected by the sky at every location and all the millions of blue jeans in every state of fading constantly change, and yet we somehow have a consensus of the basic form Blueness as it applies to them.

But if the very nature of knowledge changes, at the time when the change occurs there will be no knowledge, and, according to this view, there will be no one to know and nothing to be known: Plato believed that long before our bodies ever existed, our souls existed and inhabited heaven, where they became directly acquainted with the forms themselves.

Real knowledge, to him, was knowledge of the forms.

But knowledge of the forms cannot be gained through sensory experience because the forms are not in the physical world. Therefore, our real knowledge of the forms must be the memory of our initial acquaintance with the forms in heaven. Therefore, what we seem to learn is in fact just remembering. No one has ever seen a perfect circle, nor a perfectly straight line, yet everyone knows what a circle and a straight line are. Plato utilizes the tool-maker's blueprint as evidence that Forms are real: Perceived circles or lines are not exactly circular or straight, and true circles and lines could never be detected since by definition they are sets of infinitely small points.

But if the perfect ones were not real, how could they direct the manufacturer? Plato was well aware of the limitations of the theory, as he offered his own criticisms of it in his dialogue Parmenides. There Socrates is portrayed as a young philosopher acting as junior counterfoil to aged Parmenides. To a certain extent it is tongue-in-cheek as the older Socrates will have solutions to some of the problems that are made to puzzle the younger.

The dialogue does present a very real difficulty with the Theory of Forms, which Plato most likely only viewed as problems for later thought. These criticisms were later emphasized by Aristotle in rejecting an independently existing world of Forms. It is worth noting that Aristotle was a pupil and then a junior colleague of Plato; it is entirely possible that the presentation of Parmenides "sets up" for Aristotle; that is, they agreed to disagree.

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One difficulty lies in the conceptualization of the "participation" of an object in a form or Form. The young Socrates conceives of his solution to the problem of the universals in another metaphor, which though wonderfully apt, remains to be elucidated: Nay, but the idea may be like the day which is one and the same in many places at once, and yet continuous with itself; in this way each idea may be one and the same in all at the same time. But exactly how is a Form like the day in being everywhere at once? The solution calls for a distinct form, in which the particular instances, which are not identical to the form, participate; i.

The concept of "participate", represented in Greek by more than one word, is as obscure in Greek as it is in English. Plato hypothesized that distinctness meant existence as an independent being, thus opening himself to the famous third man argument of Parmenides, [41] which proves that forms cannot independently exist and be participated. If universal and particulars — say man or greatness — all exist and are the same then the Form is not one but is multiple.

If they are only like each other then they contain a form that is the same and others that are different. Thus if we presume that the Form and a particular are alike then there must be another, or third Form, man or greatness by possession of which they are alike. An infinite regression would then result; that is, an endless series of third men. The ultimate participant, greatness, rendering the entire series great, is missing. Moreover, any Form is not unitary but is composed of infinite parts, none of which is the proper Form. The young Socrates some may say the young Plato did not give up the Theory of Forms over the Third Man but took another tack, that the particulars do not exist as such.

Whatever they are, they "mime" the Forms, appearing to be particulars.

This is a clear dip into representationalism , that we cannot observe the objects as they are in themselves but only their representations. That view has the weakness that if only the mimes can be observed then the real Forms cannot be known at all and the observer can have no idea of what the representations are supposed to represent or that they are representations.

Socrates' later answer would be that men already know the Forms because they were in the world of Forms before birth. The mimes only recall these Forms to memory. The topic of Aristotle's criticism of Plato's Theory of Forms is a large one and continues to expand.

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Rather than quote Plato, Aristotle often summarized. Classical commentaries thus recommended Aristotle as an introduction to Plato. As a historian of prior thought, Aristotle was invaluable, however this was secondary to his own dialectic and in some cases he treats purported implications as if Plato had actually mentioned them, or even defended them. In examining Aristotle's criticism of The Forms, it is helpful to understand Aristotle's own hylomorphic forms , by which he intends to salvage much of Plato's theory.

In the summary passage quoted above [44] Plato distinguishes between real and non-real "existing things", where the latter term is used of substance.

Theory of forms - Wikipedia

The figures that the artificer places in the gold are not substance, but gold is. Aristotle stated that, for Plato, all things studied by the sciences have Form and asserted that Plato considered only substance to have Form. Uncharitably, this leads him to something like a contradiction: Forms existing as the objects of science, but not-existing as non-substance. Ross objects to this as a mischaracterization of Plato.

Plato did not claim to know where the line between Form and non-Form is to be drawn. As Cornford points out, [46] those things about which the young Socrates and Plato asserted "I have often been puzzled about these things" [47] in reference to Man, Fire and Water , appear as Forms in later works.

However, others do not, such as Hair, Mud, Dirt. Of these, Socrates is made to assert, "it would be too absurd to suppose that they have a Form. Ross [45] also objects to Aristotle's criticism that Form Otherness accounts for the differences between Forms and purportedly leads to contradictory forms: That particulars participate in a Form is for Aristotle much too vague to permit analysis. By one way in which he unpacks the concept, the Forms would cease to be of one essence due to any multiple participation. Plato had postulated that we know Forms through a remembrance of the soul's past lives and Aristotle's arguments against this treatment of epistemology are compelling.

For Plato, particulars somehow do not exist, and, on the face of it, "that which is non-existent cannot be known". The theory is presented in the following dialogues: From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. For the band, see The Forms band. Plato from Raphael 's The School of Athens — This article possibly contains original research.

Please improve it by verifying the claims made and adding inline citations. Statements consisting only of original research should be removed. February Learn how and when to remove this template message. Ross, Plato's Theory of Ideas However, it is attributed to Plato without any direct textual evidence that Plato himself holds the views of the speakers of the dialogues.

Lives of Eminent Philosophers. He also uses expressions such as to x auto , "the x itself" or kath' auto "in itself". They were eternal, changeless, supremely real, and independent of ordinary objects that had their being and properties by 'participating' in them. Form" of The Great Ideas: This source states that Form or Idea get capitalized according to this convention when they refer "to that which is separate from the characteristics of material things and from the ideas in our mind.

The form must be the same, but the material may vary For the creation God used "the pattern of the unchangeable," which is "that which is eternal. Some readers will have long since remembered that in Aristotle time and space are accidental forms. Plato does not make this distinction and concerns himself mainly with essential form.

In Plato, if time and space were admitted to be form, time would be atemporal and space aspatial. For the usage refer to "a- 2 ". They are however customary terms of modern metaphysics; for example, see Beck, Martha C. For the full range of meanings consult the American Heritage Dictionary online under ethnic. If nothing exists then nothing can be known. It is possible that Plato took the Socratic search for definitions and extrapolated it into a distinct metaphysical theory. Little is known of the historical Socrates' own views, but the theory of Forms is likely a Platonic innovation.

Second Edition with Additions". Grote points out that Aristotle lifted this argument from the Parmenides of Plato; certainly, his words indicate the argument was already well-known under that name. Friday Five With Patricia Moreno.

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